A Debate on Gaming Stereotypes

[heatseeker]

So I was watching the "season finale" of SNL with Steve Carrell and they were doing a Deal or No Deal spoof where the spoof Dad of Carrell said, "you are such a loser with your monster men and deadbeat friends." to which Carrell replied, "It's a Warhammer gaming club!"

I admittedly laughed at this because they were mentioning Warhammer in a skit, but the thing that bothers me is that is this what society views gamers as? I can say that a large majority of the GW fanboys may actually fit into that description, but I kind of felt like all gamers were being attacked and stereotyped as the sweaty, loser with no aspirations for life. I know I do not fit the stereotype I have been labeled as as I shower and workout practically everyday. I also work extremely hard at everything I do (work, school, responsibilities, etc.) and have huge aspirations for what I want to accomplish. Also, the thing that bothers me is when I mention that I enjoy miniature gaming to someone, they immediately categorize me into that stereotype. "Oh, so you do THAT. Playing with toys!?" That kind of reaction. The thing is, I do not feel it is necessary for someone to immediately jump to conclusions about a person just because they "game" as not all of us even remotely fit that negative description (our club is the perfect outlier of that label). Of course the kind of people that say these things I have not talked to much and it would be someone in a class of mine while I would be reading a Codex or general idiots online.

What do you guys think? Have you ever had an experience on the topic of gaming where you felt mistakenly categorized as the negative stereotype? Do you think because a majority of gamers may fit into that description rules out the fact that gamers can be viewed to the contrary? Do you think that these kind of people that jump to conclusions are just ignorant in their own right?

Lend me your thoughts

[siriq]

ive had the reaction of "that doesnt sound like fun" or "sounds like alot of work" but in general i dont tell people i play until i know them well enough.

[modius13]

The parents of my High School girlfriend still think I'm the "Son of Satan" because I wore black, listened to "dark" music and was part of the Games Club. Yes, I was one of those "Devil-worshiping D&D players" ... who was a Lutheran and had never actually played a game of D&D of any sort. And apparently I was also plotting to shoot up the school because I wore a trench coat and my step-dad works for the post office.

[RARE CHOICE GAMES]

I have just come to realize that most of the people who think that way are pricks and/or bitches so it doesnt matter what they think cause in 6 months to a year they will end up with some kind of sexually transmitted disease that will hopefully eat away at their will to live.

[Pop goes the world]

As a gamer who has attended GenCon and tabletop wargamed for going on 19 years, I can say that about 50% of gamers accurately fit that negative stereotype. The other 50% are 'daywalkers' of sorts who can camouflage more or less with the rest of society. Since the 'normal' half tend to be good humored and self-deprecating and the 'stereotypical' half simply reinforce the stereotype, the picture of the live-at-home, non-bathing, mountain-dew-drinking, cape-wearing gamer has no reason to go away. Keep in mind that that stereotype is largely an American thing that is not indicative of the world-wide gaming community.

[modius13]

May 21, 2008 19:25:14 GMT -6 RARE CHOICE GAMES said:

... doesnt matter what they think cause in 6 months to a year they will end up with some kind of sexually transmitted disease that will hopefully eat away at their will to live.

I wish, but the last time I saw those bastards was about 7 years ago now... apparently they're still alive and well.

and watch it LMB,J... I drink Mt. Dew and I'm sure I blend in just well.

[Pop goes the world]

I don't know about 'blend in,' but I doubt that the 'blending in' look is the one you are going for.

[Pop goes the world]

It can all be summed up with this...


We need to remember that no matter how cool we consider ourselves to be, we are still dorks. We know it is dorky to play miniatures games, otherwise we wouldn't be bothered by 'real' dorks giving us a bad name. We would not mention miniatures gaming in a pickup line, because we know it is dorky. I have personally hidden my miniatures habit from every girlfriend I ever had until I felt they liked me well enough to overlook it. If we can't accept our dorky nature, we should find new hobbies.

Gaming is all about escapism; we do it because it gives us an outlet with which to fantasize, and it offers us an opportunity to control little armies of toys in order to compensate for a lack of control over the rest of the world. The sooner we accept that fact, the sooner we can get down to enjoying ourselves instead of contemplating the social implications of our silly hobby.

[Leudast1215]

It's not dorky to play with toy soldiers if you can accept the fact that you're playing with toy soldiers and laugh to yourself about it before praying to the dice gods and if you can't do that, well you have some personal issues to work out with yourself. Frankly most of the people I've known throughout my life that would be considered "gamers" were and are really smart, it's the people who stereotype and, more importantly, criticize gamers based on said stereotypes that probably don't do so hot in other areas of life. Btw Ian your trench coat is awesome don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Although I am curious about something: When and if we bring up the topic that we play with toy soldiers, do people ignorant of the past time even realise that the most satisfying part is the hobby aspect and just hanging out with other people enjoying a similar pursuit? I mean I've never been criticised or seen anyone be for being in the "modeling" hobby (building WWII tanks, planes, etc...), but mention minis and people's impression suddenly changes because it's no longer a perceived dignified past time (like modeling) it's now childish toys... oh well, I get criticised more for being a military historian than I do for gaming anyway (people don't like having their WRONG High School interpretations of WWII shattered hehe).

[modius13]

I revel in my dorkiness. Though, I think people look ar me weirder for building things with knobs and switches that make odd noises than for the gaming thing.

[Leudast1215]

I make my odd noises, don't need no switches and knobs

[Andrew]

I'd have to agree with Adam. A great many of the gamers in our hobbies are unfortunately stereotypical in appearance, personality, and manners, and frankly it sucks. But then, this is just an outlet for them as it is for us. It depends on whether you embrace it as a lifestyle or keep it as a hobby. Heck, if I wanted to get mean I would call Adam's re-enactments as Live Action Real Time Strategy (LARTS). But things are always more complex than that, and frankly I think it's cool and would want to do it meself.

Tom has a good point about the fine line between gaming and modeling. If you were to buy GW mini's for instance, but never actually play and only get stuff you wanted to build/paint/display, it'd be like any other model company out there, just that they are rooted in sci-fi. I like that, because few other sci-fi stuff in the other companies really interest me. It's all either from movies/tv shows or just odd. I've seen warhammer and warmachine mini's turn up at "regular" model shows and competitions, and they are painted ridiculously well.

I also am part of the Lakes Region Scale Modelers, and while the majority of the men there are older (30's-60's), they seem to show similar appearances; the majority are balding, overweight, but they have a different sort of personality. They are relaxed, and simply enjoying time together, showing off things they've done, etc. Of course there are one or two that get cranky over the smallest slight and they suck the fun out of things, but they're ignored.

I also hid my gaming stuff from all my girlfriends until I felt they would be accepting of it. One never saw any of it. Some like it, some hate it, some find it a curiosity and write it off as just a hobby. The best ones, like Nicole, have fun and play the game with me.

I've faced down the stereotypes before and was still accepted by people in high school (zomg wow!) because I didn't fit the stereotype and just had an odd enthusiasm for things. Plus, every typically came to me for answers with stuff and I suppose it wouldn't do to write me off for that, lolz.

[heatseeker]

It's good that everyone is on the same page as myself on the criticisms they receive for playing a game. It really is just a game and not our entire lives, just something we do for fun as a hobby. If anyone has any other opinions such as, "That's stupid!" or "Why are you wasting your time?" you just take their opinion as something to ignore and do not associate with people that do not respect you as a person or what personal choices you engage in.

Like Andrew and Adam has said, I too have pretty much hid my hobby from all sorts of people on conversation basis. Of course I have a shit load of models displayed in my room and when they see them they definitely inquire about it and generally say that they are really cool (my gf for instance, a total girly girl, thinks fantasy is amazing and talked about starting a Vampire Counts army after looking more into Warhammer and myself telling her more about it). Besides that, painting and modeling takes an extreme amount of patience and finesse to do. That can say a lot about a person when they display their custom models that are insanely painted when it is not even their real job. It is no walk in the park and can take hours just to paint 1 mini with that kind of detail.

As any hobby or enjoyment outside of the work world, it really is just something to escape the stresses of everyday life. When you come home from a long day at work and start painting or modeling, is that any different from when someone puts in a dvd or reads a book in the same circumstances? A hobby is a hobby. It does suck that a lot of the uber nerds give the whole genre a bad name, but you are always going to have naysayers in all facets of life that focus on the negative. People just bash on stuff they don't understand. It's a fun, social activity for people to engage in when they have free time. Can you really say any more than that?

[kernbanks]

my two cents... if it is even worth that much...

I've never met any of you guys, so sorry for any offenses. But I think it comes down to self confidence, everything comes down to self confidence.

I live and work in an environment of 100% Alpha + personalities... not talking jocks or the cool click in school... i'm an officer in an airborne infantry brigade deployed to Afghanistan. Now I think that is pretty cool, as do my comrades, but shit talk and hazing are second nature. you give and you get it. You might be surprised how many 6' tall, 200lb, 7% or less body fat guys play 'games' as we call them... as you have all said it is just a hobby, there are at least a half dozen here, we brought small armies and goof around in the small amount of down time we get. now there are some guys who try and hide it, they lack confidence. guys who hide it are the ones that can't take the pressure of what others think.

I saw it similar growing up, highschool clubs, college clubs, etc... it all comes down to self confidence and if you are ok with who you are. people for the most part don't care what you do in your personal time, but if you are not OK with it... well you need to look inside to fix it.

The uber nerds we see and talk about, they lack self confidence. at some point somewhere along the line they started to believe what they were doing was wrong and they go off, hide by themselves, and loose touch with others because they don't think other normal people do it. it is a avalanche effect... less going out leads to less friends leads to less normal social habits... the end state - someone who has fallen completely off the social train.

well, my two cents appeared to become two bits. (that's a quarter for those of you who don't know).

[ddaypunk06]

I agree that there are stereotypes...however a good many of us in this club don't totally fit that stereotype. A good portion of us still chill and do the "normal" people thing.

However, as Adam put it, we are all a buncha dorks. Who fuckin cares really. SNL is meant to be funny and is equally mean to all cliques. I'm a dork and damn proud of it. If you haven't noticed so is my gf and she's more normal than most of us anyways lol.

I have met some of my coolest friends through this club and this game. Ben Silver, for example, is much more than the Warmachine he plays. The founders of this club and the first class of members were far from the typical gamers. Bill Novak and John Clemens are yet two more examples. I have met so many cool people through this club and its not just because we play this game.

WE go to the junction allllllll the time and talk more than just games. Its not always WH or 40k or WM or Hordes or etc. We joke about just about anything and its just fun being friends. I bet we could disband this club and stop playing these games and still be good friends. Shit I never see Josh or Matt and they some of my best friends.

Again...who the fuck cares. No one will change any outsiders opinion of us till they invite them in and show them how fun we can be. All wargamers may be dorks but not all dorks are cliche about it.

*Cough* "magic players smell!" (on a side note I play magic lol...yet another example of how not all gamers are the same as that 50% Adam mentioned as the weird ones lol)

Added:

I also just remembered something. I now work at the Lincoln Hwy store for Subway and I have met a buncha people who are cool with it. The manager Jess, Andrew, and manager Jim are all cool with it. Specifically Jess, I brought up RPG and she could care less and didn't think me any different. Then I found out she was a comic nut.

If someone sees you differently after you mention gaming, fuck em. Plain and simple. I don't hide it.

[modius13]

yay for soap-boxing, Delso...

And as this is SNL we're talking about, might I add... "MORE COWBELL!"

....

*ahem*

[ddaypunk06]

ENCORE!

[dragonbait]

Game loud, game proud. After going to about 2-3 bigger conventions every year for the past three years, I feel almost normal compared to the people you see there. Hell, if my DAD didn't get me into gaming when I was younger...what the hell would I be like now? I'd probably have a completely different crowd of friends, and would probably look at you as honkin dorks. Well, I still do...but I'm one of them too damnit! Us nerds that give gaming a good name rock. Hands down. Us. Game for life. Semper Fi bitch (I'm sure some of you have seen Red vs Blue..and if not, I'm apalled!)

[ddaypunk06]

I agree with Frizz, we are the ones that give gaming a good name. The non-normal looking players like us give normal people a hope that gamers aren't all alike. Kudos Friz.