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Post by Andrew on Sept 23, 2009 19:42:39 GMT -6
This is what I've got on tap for a 30pt army:
Commander Stryker
- Ol' Rowdy
- Lancer
Junior Warcaster
- Defender
- Charger
Rangers
Basically, the plan is for each element to support each other. The ranged jacks add their support to the Rangers, taking on the tougher targets the Ranger's rifles can't deal with. Stryker and his group block/counter charge other enemies to keep them away from the ranged parts.
It worked reasonably well. Too bad Rios's super-stryker just cut poor Rowdy in two with one strike. Rolling up a 45 is so lame...but now that I know that you can take epic casters in any points level, I might do that myself. Basically though, what else would be good to augment/replace this core? More ranged, like a long gunner unit, or a second ironclad in place of the lancer? Or both?
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Post by Pop goes the world on Sept 23, 2009 20:36:15 GMT -6
A couple of critiques-
You might have too many 'jacks on the Jr. That is a lot of eggs in one basket- a basket that can be easily tipped by a single snipe or spell, leaving your 'jacks casterless. I might recommend throwing the Charger with Stryker (and eventually replacing the Charger with a Hunter).
I know you are just playing with what you have right now, so you don't have a ton of options, but keep in mind that the Rangers are a support unit, not a vanguard. If you find that they are under preforming, it is probably because they are a unit designed to support higher point value games. As soon as you get a chance, pick up some Long Gunners. You will find that they will excel in every game you play. Obviously, Rios is the guy to talk to about tweaking your Cygnar.
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Post by Andrew on Sept 23, 2009 21:05:54 GMT -6
I did discover today that the poor little junior doesn't have enough focus to help out both jacks. The problem is I liked the performance of both too much. The Charger was sufficient to down infantry and the Hunter, while the Defender was as fantastic as you said it would be. I'd probably drop the Lancer for now, as it was just meh for me, though as a light, combat jack I don't know what it can do, other than hold off weak infantry and arc spells.
Looking through the new cards, two units really caught my eye: Long Gunners, of course, and the Black 13th. I think they'd fit in well, I like the models, and they're overall cool. Dropping the Lancer, adding in Black 13th and Long Gunners, and let's see...
(-6) Commander Stryker
(9) - Ol' Rowdy
(4) - Charger
(3) Junior
(9) - Defender
(5) 6 Rangers
(6) 6 Long Gunners
(4) Black 13th
Total 34 points. However, if I swapped the Long Gunners for 3 Storm Lancers I'd be at 35 points. Another thought: even though the 13th is called a character unit, can a spell like Snipe still affect them, and if so, all of them?
I do also own Lt. Caine...which might fit in better for the overall army theme.
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Post by Rios on Sept 23, 2009 23:56:27 GMT -6
yes you can give them snipe. but I do not think that it works with their snipe also
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Post by Rios on Sept 23, 2009 23:57:05 GMT -6
and drop the Charger for a Lancer, Stryker needs them to spam Equakes
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Post by Pop goes the world on Sept 24, 2009 1:28:00 GMT -6
Long gunners are a million times better than 3 Storm Lances any day. Storm lances are more of a harassing force, as they get taken out quicker than you think. Multiple wounds, honestly, rarely means anything except with casters. Once in a while you luck out, but usually you take enough damage to get dropped anyway.
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Post by Pop goes the world on Sept 24, 2009 1:29:13 GMT -6
Also, I second Mike's recommendation for dropping the charger and grabbing a lancer.
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Post by ddaypunk06 on Sept 28, 2009 12:18:53 GMT -6
I agree, I'm not much for the charger.
Also with the long gunners comment. They work really well in my magnus list. If I had cygnar I would totally do gun mages lol.
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Post by tkaz84 on Nov 21, 2009 22:17:58 GMT -6
/thread necromancy
I would give the Defender to Stryker and give the Charger to the Journeyman. The Defender does indeed have a big-ass gun, but with its hammer it is actually more pwerful in melee, expecially given the automatic cortex damage. And giving a melee jack to Junior = bad. The Charger can work with only 1 focus a turn, leaving Junior with 2 other points to upkeep AS and shoot things.
Also I'm wondering how attached you are to the Rangers. You could replace them with the Lancer others have suggested and come out to 35 pts exactly. Rangers are cool, but the only things in this list that benefit from them are the Long Gunners (who should be using CRA and thus be able to hit whatever they shoot at regardless), the Charger (which should always spend 1 focus for double boosts) and the Defender (which shouldn't need help hitting most jacks and will probably be getting focus to boost).
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Post by ddaypunk06 on Nov 23, 2009 11:47:12 GMT -6
I agree with them. When I played you, your rangers didnt pose much a threat. I would pick something to back up your jacks or bring on a full 10 Long Gunners. They can be nasty if you get them into a good spot early on.
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Post by Andrew on Nov 25, 2009 23:37:10 GMT -6
I see the point about the rangers. I just like the models so much...maybe they'll move over to being ratling snipers for my IG...*shrug*.
What about taking a second defender, maybe in place of Rowdy or the Charger? The cortex-smashing hammer effect is tres nice.
(-6) Commander Stryker
(9) - Defender
(6) - Lancer
(3) Junior
(9) - Defender
(6) 6 Long Gunners
(4) Black 13th
(3) Eiryss
What about squires, lightning wizards, and other useful solos?
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Post by Pop goes the world on Nov 26, 2009 3:19:18 GMT -6
If you are looking to fry cortexes, the Lancer's shield is always a good way to go. You do damage to cortexes both when you get hit, and when you hit with it. Trust me- that damage adds up fast... Plus, you have another arc node floating around.
I might recommend trying to max out your unit of long gunners. Taking the Black 13th at such a low point value gobbles up a lot of points. You could probably spend them more efficiently on, say, a full unit of Long gunners and a squire to help support your 'jack casting.
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Post by ddaypunk06 on Nov 27, 2009 13:53:18 GMT -6
(Agrees with adam)
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Post by Andrew on Nov 27, 2009 19:33:17 GMT -6
I ordered the long gunner attachment to boost them to 8, as well as get them some more abilities.
What are your thoughts on the centurion for holding off assaults? As well, what's the best way to use Anastasia de Bray? If I were to focus more on shooting units, would it be better to use Caine for more shooting, or Stryker to knock enemies down to keep them away? And now the latest list:
(-6) Commander Stryker
(2) Squire
(9) - Defender
(6) - Lancer
(3) Junior
(9) - Defender
(8) 6 Long Gunners + Officer/Banner
(4) Black 13th
Big benefit of the B13 is that they can light up an important target so everything else can shoot it. So many targets now have stealth...
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Post by Pop goes the world on Nov 27, 2009 20:47:04 GMT -6
I don't know if the attachment would be best suited for low point values- maybe just use the models to fill out a full unit, not the actual attachments- The longgunner attachment is really only worth its points if you field a full unit, otherwise it is a waste (especially at low point values). The long gunners are good, but feeble- you can lose a lot of them quickly. A big unit will allow you to both absorb ranged damage, and deal massive amounts of combined-range goodness.
The Centurion is pretty good, but not as good as he used to be (in my opinion- especially since weapon locks are so easy to pull off now). Plus, I don't know if he fits with the spirit of your basic list.
By the looks of your list, you have a decent ranged thing going on- Eiryss will be good with this list- she will provide an unavoidable distraction while still offering ranged support. Anastasia is weird- again, I don't know if I would field her at such a low point value. I don't know if you will have the points to support her, or have anyone close enough to her should she actually pull off her mini-feat.
If you are looking to fill points, Stormsmiths are still good (if not as good as before). Cheap, though.
For a ranged list, Striker offers good support. Otherwise, Hayley is good.
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Post by ddaypunk06 on Nov 28, 2009 15:43:40 GMT -6
The only mercs I am familiar with so far in MK2 are the ones I play.
Anastasia de Bray is an interesting solo but from what I remember shes a bit hard to get the strategy right with.
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