Custom 5th Edition Eldar Errata

[dragonbait]

Here at Eldar, we're better than you, and we know it!

[Leudast1215]

There's no wish listing for me to comment on?

I play space (hobbits) too my T3 friend ^_^.

[equinox]

Those that wear tight pants don't need anything other than a swift kick in said pants.



Bonesingers and Slicing Orbs, that is about it. Maybe expand Harlies to include the Solitares, Shadowseer (real ones), and Mimes.

[dragonbait]

I really don't have any problems with any of the eldar codex. Just a few minor ones.

1.) Granted it's not a big part of the game....but asides from one of the phoenix lords having acute senses, we have no Night Fight gear. For being one of the eldest races, we can't do anything about darkness? lol...give us some searchlights.

2.) For their ridiculous point costs, only one phoenix lord has an invulnerable save. Granted they already have eternal warrior and a 2+ armor save, but give em an invul save...even if it's a crappy 5+ or 6+. Raise their points if you have to.

3.) Eldar Jetbikes....Aside from being able to turbo boost last turn and steal an objective, these guys pretty much blow. Even in a maxed out squad, they can't lay down a heavy amount of firepower and die pretty easily. It's probably just me, but this unit just bugs me.

4.) Vypers....terrible. Landspeeders and even sentinels are much better fast attack options and harassers. They're ridiculously expensive to give any sort of anti-tank weapon, and if you're going for anti-infantry units warwalkers are much better. Just too costly to do any job ffectively.

Like I said, nothing major. I know other players that units that I mentioned above very well, I just don't like them currently.

[equinox]

Dragonbait - Thanks for reminding me.

Phoenix Lords - 0-1 choice. Allows their aspect to be taken as a troop choice. Allow them to purchase a retinue of their aspect. Allow said retinue to upgrade any number of models to exarch status.

[Andrew]

Waaa! Eldar are already the brokeback army that wins. If you can't, well sucks to be you!

Now that my required harassing is out of the way, lessee what you wish for this Christmas...

1. Acute senses/Night Sight on Dark Reapers, Phoenix Lords, and probably Falcons/Fire Prizms would make the most sense. However, since Night Fight is so rare and so short term in standard games, it probably isn't needed.

2. Not needed. If you find your Lords getting gunned down...you're probably doing something wrong. When used well, I find it very, very difficult to kill them in regular games.

3. They are far better than how you are using them, young padawan. They haven't changed in a couple editions and people have won well with them...

4. Ditto for Vypers. Their cost reflects their awesomesauce speed and the ability to fire two weapons at 12". Warwalkers boast neither of those. Though I would wish for the base cost to maybe start at 35 or so, to account for the lower BS than other skimmers.

To sound like Tom (teehee!), all you have to say is "I just don't like these units so I feel they need to change to be better."

Again, equinox came up with a nice addition to a codex, though upgrading any number of models to be exarchs might be a bit much.

[equinox]

Dec 30, 2008 16:29:11 GMT -6 Andrew said:

Again, equinox came up with a nice addition to a codex, though upgrading any number of models to be exarchs might be a bit much.

If we are talking only the bodyguard retinue, it would be comparable to a space marine chapter master's retinue. The downside of doing this is going to be cost. The nice thing is this would be very much in character for each exarch. I honestly think that the current codex originally intended something like this, but it was dropped at the last minute.

Like everything I write, I like the concept, but till I see how it plays out, I am not signing off on it.

[RARE CHOICE GAMES]

I have to agree with andrew on the Vyper's. Caleb has always used them and they have often torn apart the competition. So...yeah...Vypers are good in my book.

[Andrew]

I think the phoenix lords are more likely to be loners than have a retinue, but having said that I totally dig the "aspect as Troops" change, as it keeps in line with GW's new policy towards FOC changes with certain special characters.

[Leudast1215]

I agree with the Phoenix Lords and the aspect thingy.

I'm not too fond of the Jet Bikes myself... Don't know what to do about them.

Vypers are better than Tau Piranhas so little sympathy there .

Night Fight really doesn't matter much, maybe slap it on a couple units at most? It's a very rare ability.

Btw I never said that anywhere in my posts ever Andrew . I claim that a unit is under-priced and/or badly designed ^_^. And it's not just me... the web has exploded (as much as a miniature hobby can) with fandex's for codices that will not receive an update for years so I'm far from alone with my objections.

[ddaypunk06]

I would like to try out the Phoenix Lord retinue dealy. Sounds like an interesting concept. It makes sense that a Lord would be followed by people in that Aspect, even into battle.

Vypers actually played a good part in my armies in the past. They are a bit expensive though. Maybe drop a few points or make the upgrades a bit less...they are basically the same price as the ones on bigger eldar vehicles.

Don't know much about jet bikes. The nice part is they can capture an objective at the last minute.

Night Fight...don't know what to do their, but your point on them being an old race makes sense fluff wise...HEY YOU WITH THE POINTY EARS ITS CALLED NIGHT VISION!

[Leudast1215]

I do find it ironic that the youngest "official" race in the galaxy, Tau, has access to more Night Fighting technology than the oldest race in the galaxy .

Perhaps fluff wise it can be explained (however inadequately) that since the Eldar are so old, smart and honorable they'd prefer to slice and dice up an opponent in daylight because they don't need to resort to the dishonorable trickery and deceit that is a night attack to win like the Tau?

[equinox]

Dec 30, 2008 19:56:31 GMT -6 Andrew said:

I think the phoenix lords are more likely to be loners than have a retinue, but having said that I totally dig the "aspect as Troops" change, as it keeps in line with GW's new policy towards FOC changes with certain special characters.

Depends on the fluff. My favorite is when Maugen Ra showed up on Ulthwe with a battalion of Dark Reapers during the Eye of Terror campaign. There is also an old fluff about the Scorpion Phoenix Lord hunting with a large group of striking scorpions. So the fluff is there to support them showing up with large numbers of their aspects.

[Andrew]

Exactly...based on having the units as Troops more likely, not so well represented by a retinute. My favorite is the Maugan Ra one too.

[Leudast1215]

I don't think it's wise to look for fluff in a codex to determine to determine what should or should be done. For game play purposes it's more fair to look at the trends set by the most recent codices. Since Space Marine and Ork special characters screw around with the FOC, then an Eldar special character should too by logic.

[siriq]

I agree that eldar should have more night fight. I remember reading about striking scorpions in particular that fight at night and quite good at it. I like the idea of a phoenix lord changing the FOC it makes sense fluff wise and balance wise. Although i would have to say the eldar codex was some what conceived with 5th rule in mind or some phoenix lords wouldn't have such high bs.

for vipers i think they are really good at 2 things, out flanking and taking fire. While they have been weakened a great deal by 5th by the amount of fire power they can put out they have some what gained in versatility. just put a missile launcher on there and you have a fast mobile platform that can cause pinning with its plasma missiles. and if the opportunity arises you can get some back armor with 2 strength 4 and 1 str 8 shot. I do agree the price may need to come down on the weapons a little. They need to move quickly to gain position this gives them a little advantage of survivability while they move. something i would like to see is an option for a shield to remove the open topped nature of a viper like they did with the walker.

One thing i do dislike about the new codex and with 5th is it change eldar into taking hordes of guarding to hold objectives. This is where jet bikes come in. They are actually good at what they do and that is move quickly and gain that 3+ invul save until they are need to take or contest a objective. I think using a phoenix lord to make something like striking scorpions troops for this purpose would make taking one a must for competitive lists, but might change the nature of the unit.

that is all i can think of right now...

[equinox]

Jan 1, 2009 4:18:32 GMT -6 Leudast1215 said:

I don't think it's wise to look for fluff in a codex to determine to determine what should or should be done. For game play purposes it's more fair to look at the trends set by the most recent codices. Since Space Marine and Ork special characters screw around with the FOC, then an Eldar special character should too by logic.

I agree to a point, but the fluff does need to drive the army to a degree, otherwise, why not just have space marines and be done. The SC trend has been established and will continue.

[dragonbait]

Also, Tom....it seemed like some things in your wish lists were purely fluff driven.

[Leudast1215]

I was trying to defend your wish-listing by claiming that when it comes to new rule trends, the special character thingy in this instance, that it's fair for friendly games for a Eldar special character to fiddle with the FOC just as a Space Marine or Ork dude.

It's not entirely fair to claim by written fluff to deny such a clear gaming trend to a technically out-dated codex for friendly games, in other words.

As far as Night Fight goes, the only time it's been an issue is for this up-coming tournament... I wish it would affect movement too because the image of Space Marines fumbling around in the dark is priceless.

[ddaypunk06]

Don't the SM pretty much mirror their fluff in game? Their stat lines do for sure. Just as the eldar stat lines do with a bit better Init and lower S/T. Since the marines are basically a splitting image of their fluff, I don't see why the Eldar or any other race shouldn't.

I still like the Phoenix lord retinue idea, or allowing them to be taken as an elite choice if with their aspect. They do get bonuses already though. They become fearless or something.

I do think they had 5th edition in mind, but somethings weren't cemented yet when the released the Eldar codex. Its still considered a 4th ed codex isn't it?

In my opinion they need to get a better release schedule going. Its nice they updated the daemons and chaos marines but why not pair the Inquisition rules with it. It nerfs and army for 4 years. Thats stupid. Even if it were a marketing ploy for money it wouldn't work. They would be better off releasing books that directly affect one another like that in conjunction with one another. I understand the whole core rule affecting everything, but nerfing one by beefing up another, and then throwing the affected one on the back burner for years is ridiculous.

Anyways, I'm still up for trying out somethings with my eldar. Such as the Lords and their aspects and maybe updating the other harlequin characters a bit.